The Anarchist Underground

Political movement
 
HomeTestCalendarGalleryFAQSearchMemberlistUsergroupsRegisterLog in

Share | 
 

 The Audacity of Trotsky

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
AuthorMessage
killuminati
Admin
avatar

Posts : 461
Join date : 2008-08-04
Age : 23
Location : RIGHT BEHIND YOU!

PostSubject: The Audacity of Trotsky   Thu Oct 23, 2008 9:11 pm

In War Communism and Terrorism published by Trotsky that year he said The unions should discipline the workers and teach them to place the interests of production above their own needs and demands. It is impossible to distinguish between these policies and the labour policies of Stalin.




And I thought he was decent.

_________________
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Black_Cross
Admin
avatar

Posts : 98
Join date : 2008-07-08
Age : 29
Location : Amerikkka

PostSubject: Re: The Audacity of Trotsky   Mon Oct 27, 2008 8:04 pm

Killuminati wrote:
In War Communism and Terrorism published by Trotsky that year he said The unions should discipline the workers and teach them to place the interests of production above their own needs and demands. It is impossible to distinguish between these policies and the labour policies of Stalin.

Alright, let's not make Trotsky out to be anything near Stalin. I know, Trotsky killed our peeps, and fuck him for it. But hey, he took an ice-pick to the head. Not only that, he forgave the guy (sorta) and saved him from being gunned down. And it's not like you cannot find some merit in this quote. Yes, i can see how this is wrong, but discipline is necessary for the success of the revolution. But it's not the unions who should discipline the workers, it's the workers who should discipline themselves.

And just to add one thing, if the production is in the hands of the people, and not the state (i know Trotsky's stance differs from ours in this respect), then the interests of production are one in the same as the interests of the people. And though we know that Trotsky was wrong when saying this, since the means and ends of production were held by the state, Trotsky himself believed the state to be a workers' state, defunct though it may have been. So really our differences here are minute, lose the part about unions enforcing discipline.

_________________
"Here then is the problem which we present to you. Stark and dreadful and inescapable: Shall we put an end to the human race; or shall mankind renounce war?"
--Albert Einstein--Bertrand Russell--
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Inkus2000
Admin
avatar

Posts : 284
Join date : 2008-07-04

PostSubject: Re: The Audacity of Trotsky   Tue Oct 28, 2008 5:10 am

I agree - Trotsky was somewhat authoritarian but Id never compare him to Stalin.
As far as Marxism goes Trotskyism isnt the worst.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
killuminati
Admin
avatar

Posts : 461
Join date : 2008-08-04
Age : 23
Location : RIGHT BEHIND YOU!

PostSubject: Re: The Audacity of Trotsky   Fri Oct 31, 2008 8:06 pm

Black_Cross wrote:
Killuminati wrote:
In War Communism and Terrorism published by Trotsky that year he said The unions should discipline the workers and teach them to place the interests of production above their own needs and demands. It is impossible to distinguish between these policies and the labour policies of Stalin.

Alright, let's not make Trotsky out to be anything near Stalin. I know, Trotsky killed our peeps, and fuck him for it. But hey, he took an ice-pick to the head. Not only that, he forgave the guy (sorta) and saved him from being gunned down. And it's not like you cannot find some merit in this quote. Yes, i can see how this is wrong, but discipline is necessary for the success of the revolution. But it's not the unions who should discipline the workers, it's the workers who should discipline themselves.

And just to add one thing, if the production is in the hands of the people, and not the state (i know Trotsky's stance differs from ours in this respect), then the interests of production are one in the same as the interests of the people. And though we know that Trotsky was wrong when saying this, since the means and ends of production were held by the state, Trotsky himself believed the state to be a workers' state, defunct though it may have been. So really our differences here are minute, lose the part about unions enforcing discipline.
I wasn't comparing him to stalin in all policies....I was just trying to make the connection between that kind of thinking to Stalin kind of thinking....I should have re-worded that better, I used to follow Trotsky ideas for a while so I know he has better ideas than this but...that doesn't lessen the effect from what he said

_________________
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: The Audacity of Trotsky   

Back to top Go down
 
The Audacity of Trotsky
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» Stalin better than Trotsky Bukharin and Zinoviev ?
» "They were never interested in paying their end of the bargain in helping out labor, because that would require making peace with people who aren't radical enough or would likely have the audacity to disagree with them."
» UFO-Trotskyism

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
The Anarchist Underground :: The Revolutionary Sphere :: Revolutionary Thoughts-
Jump to: