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 More of my bothersome queeries

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JackBrindelli

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PostSubject: More of my bothersome queeries   Tue Jan 13, 2009 3:28 pm

havent found any anarchist opinions here about the middle eastern conflict. either im looking in the wrong sections or there aren't any.
i have a question regarding it, which i shall post here since it doesn't seem like theres anywhere else it needs to be.
in an anarchist country, if there is no state, what would stop to warring factions/religions/ethnic groups kicking the shit out of each other for a previously unknown reason that has only just surfaced because of the changing world we live in. i dunno, stem cell research or something. or further more, what prevents tyranny of a majority, where anyone who is different from social norms is simply lynched?
it cant just be down to education surely? could you risk the chance that lack of knowledgewas the reason everyone has been so animalistic toward each other up to this point? what if it wasnt? elephant your answers please

here's what i said last week. im probably wrong, but oh well, it's the taking part that counts.
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=hoO7k_Ck8hk
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god0fmusic
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PostSubject: Re: More of my bothersome queeries   Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:47 pm

first, there was anarchy, and from anarchy came the state. why did there come a state? because of lack of consciousness. as the state shifts, people become aware of themselves and their surroundings, and thus the state and situations shift even more. eventually, people become fully awakened, and organize in a way which is beneficial to them and the maintaince of consciousness. this is inevitable as Karl Marx said. it is the nature of dialectics. of course Marx's ideas were very primitive and limited themselves to class struggle. he did understand that there would be new kind of consciousness and spiritual needs, but he did not elaborate, and this is the mistake of modern Marxism.

so why would there be a fight between ethnic groups? wouldn't that be characteristic of a primitive phase? it definately isn't characteristic of anarchism as an advanced phase. consciousness develops and eventually it reaches a state where it doesn't go back to what it was before unless there was some kind fo radical change. if the poles shifted and huge storms rip up the earth (i mention this because it may actually happen), the surviving people/species might return to a primitive phase.
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JackBrindelli

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PostSubject: Re: More of my bothersome queeries   Fri Jan 16, 2009 2:39 pm

god0fmusic wrote:

so why would there be a fight between ethnic groups? wouldn't that be characteristic of a primitive phase? it definately isn't characteristic of anarchism as an advanced phase. consciousness develops and eventually it reaches a state where it doesn't go back to what it was before unless there was some kind fo radical change. if the poles shifted and huge storms rip up the earth (i mention this because it may actually happen), the surviving people/species might return to a primitive phase.
so there wouldn't be any chance of accelerating development, or ending this conflict as quickly as possible?
i'm not sure if im reading you right, but are you suggesting we wait for natural disasters to sort things out for us?
what about the problems that are happening now?
perhaps im reading you wrong
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Inkus2000
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PostSubject: Re: More of my bothersome queeries   Fri Jan 16, 2009 10:21 pm

JackBrindelli wrote:
god0fmusic wrote:

so why would there be a fight between ethnic groups? wouldn't that be characteristic of a primitive phase? it definately isn't characteristic of anarchism as an advanced phase. consciousness develops and eventually it reaches a state where it doesn't go back to what it was before unless there was some kind fo radical change. if the poles shifted and huge storms rip up the earth (i mention this because it may actually happen), the surviving people/species might return to a primitive phase.
so there wouldn't be any chance of accelerating development, or ending this conflict as quickly as possible?
i'm not sure if im reading you right, but are you suggesting we wait for natural disasters to sort things out for us?
what about the problems that are happening now?
perhaps im reading you wrong

Its a mess

Look, Israel keeps Palestine as a captive market for cheap labor its no secret- I mean no development is allowed into the Gaza strip without Israels say so - its filtered, if development is seen as potentially competitive to Israeli business its not allowed in - simple. What exists in Israel is roughly on par with apatite in South Africa - the Israeli gov ensures the Gaza strip remains a third world backwater so it can use its population for slave labor - its quite simple. Aside from the socio economic exploitation, throw long lasting religious tensions into the mix and youv got a recipe for disaster.

The people of Gaza could have either voted for the notoriously corrupt Fhata or the Islamic fundamentalists Hamas - after years of being shafted by the gangsters in Fatah they chose Hamas, who want nothing more than to give Israel a kick in the nuts for continuing to occupy ''what used to be Palestine, now Israel'' and keeping thousands of its ''alleged'' members rotting in Israeli prisons. Hamas fired a few homemade rockets ''if you can call them that'' into Israel killing about 4 people in the space of year - Israel responds by killing 800-1000 mostly civilians injuring 3000 and leaving countless thousands homeless. This is in order to terrorize the populace into voting for Fatah in the next election - who are relatively submissive to Israels domination (easy to buy).

Hamas don't recognize Israel and Israel for intensive purposes don't recognize Hamas - in the meantime civilians die in droves.

As Anarchists we can just point to the dangers of nationalism, religious fundamentalism and capitalism - which are the
key factors in this scenario. However I think it unlikely that the countless Palestinian orphans created by this conflict will look forgivingly upon Israel when they come of age.

Its a vicious cycle.
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